訪問和拍攝/ Interview and photos : Nick D
翻譯/ Translation : Jose Chu
特別鳴謝/ Special Thanks : 香港設計中心設計創業培育計劃 Hong Kong Design Center, DIP.
Jimmy Choo in the house! Jimmy Chooooo! The Hong Kong DIP program invited world renown shoemaker Jimmy Choo to come talk to the incubates with his protégé Illiza Ho. What an opportunity to talk shop with the master in an intimate setting! We needed to pick his brain for the formula of success in the fashion industry, apply it, and share the message. Illiza was also interesting as a foil to Jimmy’s insights, as her handbag brand is just a few years old, and growing. Check out the lively exchange shared below.
是Jimmy Choo阿！！香港設計中心設計創業培育計劃邀請了著名鞋履設計師Jimmy Choo周仰杰和他的徒弟Illiza Ho來到我們這裡跟一班培育計劃下的新創公司們分享。不少Jimmy Choo在時尚行業的經驗很值得我們借鏡。Illiza Ho的新品牌也很讓我們大感興趣。
< < ENGLISH CONTINUES AFTER CHINESE >>
SP: 你好嗎Mr. Jimmy Choo ，可以分享一下我們現在在那裡嗎？
Jimmy Choo: 我一直在世界各地旅行。一路上去教育和指導了很多年輕人，與他們交談，並且分享我的經驗。你知道，我是英國文化協會校友全球大使，又是已故的戴安娜王妃慈善基金大使。還有馬來西亞旅遊大使哈哈！所以我一直在旅行，推廣我的慈善事業和國家。同時間去進行不少教育工作，了解世界各地不同部分，談論我的經驗。當然還有和Illiza一起經營她的手提包生意。
SP: 你覺得要去建立一個像Jimmy Choo的國際品牌過程中，勤力有多重要？
JC: 以前個個都說要勤力，但現在勤力真的不是很重要。最緊要是學懂如何建立你的個人網絡。在過去，大家都都知道勤力可以做到很多事情，但現在的世界任何東西都在網上，Facebook、Instagram等。所以你應該要知道如何利用這些途徑推廣你自已，你要懂得連接今日、現在最緊要的是什麼。做生意不只是勤力，而是要聰明。好像以前當我開始我的生意時，我們沒有聲譽。即使我的鞋只是15磅卻無人問津。今天它最起碼要500美元，但很多人會付這個錢…所以設計師們最緊要的是學懂如何照顧自己。他們當然要工作，但無需要付出更多更多的努力。作為一個設計師需要花很多時間在生產和設計這些工作上，工時很長，因此我們需要更加聰明一點。要學懂與別人分工合作。不要為這些小生意放棄自己的生活。當我開始我的事業時，沒有人理會我，那就讓我先買一些很便宜的鞋吧。這些便宜的鞋可以幫助到我的經濟和生活，而且支持我想做的事。當然我不會寫上Jimmy Choo的名字，我只是做一些手工鞋，但這些就是錢、你的收入，所以你必須思考更多去改變你的想法。我把這些鞋子買進市場但不會用Jimmy Choo的名字，而且我只賣給店舖的人，這個錢也可以讓我走得更遠。
SP: 這講法很有趣，因為很多人都覺得名聲很重要。
JC: NO！這就是為什麼人們經常會說「你為什麼要跟他交往呢？」看看我，當我開始我的事業時我什麼都不是，我必需由底做起。所以如果這刻我可以幫到別人，Why not？不是因爲錢或任何利益，而是我內心很開心、滿足的。如果我是很想要錢，你知道我可以再去找一個大投資者，開始一個新的品牌。但我已經停止了那一種工作，現在最緊要的是我對我的工作感到快樂。我現在在世界各地旅行，例如到處遊歷去分享我的經驗，就像今天來到這裡分享我的經歷，我已經很開心了。 通常我們相信人， 我們說我們將相信人們十萬年，所以你們來和他們談談。 你明白？
SP: Jimmy，鞋是你的家族生意。那到底女性想要一對怎樣的鞋呢？
JC: 我覺得她們要美麗的、舒服的… 最重要是一對好看的鞋。找對好看的然後再找舒服的。但因為現在我們做的是高級奢侈品市場，很多功夫都是去建立這個價錢。要是你喜歡這對鞋就得付出這個金錢。所以很重要是好看、舒服、永恆…非常緊要。
SP: 你有設計男裝鞋嗎？
JC: 我有設計男裝的。我為郭富城上年的演唱會設計了鞋子。我也有為其他品牌設計男裝及女裝的鞋。當然我也有設計給自己哈哈！
SP: 運動鞋呢？
JC: 運動鞋…暫時未有哈哈！
SP: 有沒有一些成就是你最驕傲的？
JC: 我想我最開心和榮幸的是，在馬來西亞的教育，9歲的孩子在學校讀書可以在課堂上讀到我的故事和歷史。這遠比金錢重要。當我一出現在歷史上，所有年輕一輩的人都會知道我對國家的付出，因此我很自豪。另外，我在世界的不同地方的時候，每個人都給予我很好的支持。
SP: 妳是什麼風格的？
Illiza Ho: 我會覺得每個人都是獨立的，不能盲目追從。我們必須知道什麼適合你自己，看看時裝雜誌選擇適合自己的衣服。當然你可以跟隨潮流，但有時未必適合你。所以最緊要都時讓自己最舒服、最無憂無慮的穿著。
JC: 我覺得優雅很重要。
SP: 是的， 說一下你的個人風格吧。因為你總是穿得很好看!
JC: 那是因為我很幸運，因為在我家馬來西亞，我有一位設計師朋友，一位非常著名的裁縫設計師。他會隨我旅遊、演講或者獲獎。因會他會為我造我的衣服，全部訂製的所以很適合我。（他讓我們看一張卡片，Lord’s）
SP: Lord’s!
JC: 對，你可以google到他們。Robert為王室、電影明星們造衫。他…應該60歲了，他年輕時學會如何設計和裁縫，及一切關於衣服的。所以每次我的西裝都很適合我。我也是他們的品牌大使，所以你見到我每個月都有很多新衣服haha！
SP: 每當我們看到你的照片，你看起來很不錯！
SP: Jimmy你是否同意我們去發展創意或運作一個公司是，有些工作需要下放給別人？
JC: 絕對肯定是的！你不可能一個人完成所有工作。以我為例，我也不能夠同一時間做好幾件事，你必須將一些工作交給別人。當你的業務還不是很大的時候當然你可以控制一切，但當你業務越來越大，你必須要有不同部門、不同種類的人協助你。當然你需要找一些可靠的人去加入你，不然會造成其他問題。所以你應該要知道在哪裏可以找到些有能力的人，然後給予他們恰當的薪金。別人也需要生活的！起碼你保持他們的生活水平，他們才會為你工作。我們絕對不能單靠自己去工作，因此我們和員工之間的信任十分緊要。如果你一味擔心他們沒有能力完成工作，又或者擔心他會搶走你的生意、抄襲你的東西，那便會產生問題。實際上只要你找到一些可靠的人跟你一起工作，那你就可以做到更多更多的事。我們的想法應該永遠都是要找些比自已厲害的人。好像我對法律會計並不了解，因此便需要付出適當的金錢去聘請律師。所以千萬不要自私，有些東西還是需要付出的。但你自己也需要一個方向，讓別人可以完全明白和跟隨你。你必須要讓你的思緒整理好，如果你整個人都很混亂的話，便會做了很多錯誤的決定。一件非常難的事情就是保持冷靜。有時我也會發脾氣，有時候我會大聲喊叫。但很奇怪，他們會知道我很生氣，但每次我尖叫時，他們都會說：“我的父親從來沒有這樣對待我！”
SP: 因為放鬆對創作也很重要吧，一個好的地方…
JC: 對！但現在很多人卻不是這樣想。你見到很多設計師都自己一手包辦所有工作，可能是因為剛開始沒有足夠資金去請人。過去我都是早上七時便工作，然後三四點便回家，八點吃晚飯然後再開始另一天的工作。但有一次我記得在London fashion week 期間一段頗忙的日子，當時實在有太多設計師好像Helmet Lang, Paul Smith等找我設計他們走Runway的鞋了。 作為一名領導者，如果我不工作，他們也會停下來的。我在工作室過了幾天。你一定要讓員工知道你也同樣需要工作，並且用多點時間關心他們。他們睡四小時你便睡兩小時，那他們便會願意繼續為你工作。這是作為一個領袖必須要的。
SP: 他們不讓我在這些睡呢！我們應該用你的訊息，Jimmy Choo說我們需要睡眠！哈哈！
JC: 有次有個員工從鞋架上面連人帶鞋掉下來了，然後他就直接睡了…Haha
SP: Illiza，你覺得你現在作為一個設計師，你有一個很好的創作環境嗎？好像一些偉大的人一同工作，會特別刺激你的創意和製作嗎？
IH: 我覺得我很多創意都來自和Jimmy的工作中。因為我可以去不同的國家見識和取得靈感，這對設計師而言十分重要。我相信作為設計師，你需要看到很多東西，並獲得很多靈感。 這就是我可以創建真正不同的設計的方式。
SP: 你可以講下Mr. Jimmy Choo的領導風格嗎？
IH: 哈哈！Jimmy是個很好的人。他不是一個自私的人，他很樂意讓你去接觸一切工作和事情。而且他不會限制我的設計和風格，這對我而言十分重要。因為我絕不希望有人限制我或控制着我的風格。我有很大的設計自由度，做我想要做的事。
SP: 那你們未來有什麼計劃嗎？
IH: 我會繼續做我的品牌和四處分享。
JC: 我都會繼續我現在的工作，我喜歡四圍遊歷，分享我的經驗。你知道現在網絡世界很發達，他們可以追蹤到我在哪裏。我依然會用我的中文名字去做我的Couture。你知道我是一個馬來西亞華人，我的父母都是華人，我們都有自已的文化。雖然我賣了我的品牌，但我依然喜歡設計，依然對我自已的名字感到自豪。很多人知道我而且還是很希望我幫他們設計鞋的。現在造鞋不是因為賺錢，而是一個興趣。
SP: 所以現在都是定制的？只有一對？
JC: 對，好像白雪仙，仙姐的鞋子都是我設計的。她現在應該90歲了，但我依然還在為她設計鞋。
SP: 你覺得你不會停止嗎？
JC: 我不想停止工作。我從來不覺得自己老了，我總是覺得自己只是50幾歲。就算Giorgio Armani 80歲都依然在工作，我想他比我更加無需工作吧，他很有錢但是還在工作。我覺得時尚可以令人覺得年輕，你永遠都不會覺得自已老。好像郭富城，年齡只是一個數字。如果你見過他跳舞，就好像一個後生仔，這是從內心散發出來的。我會繼續Keep going，不是因為老了還是有錢什麼的便不再工作。我就是我，我不貪心。我回饋我的國家、 我的學校。他們幫助我多少，我便回報多少。
SP: 為什麼時尚那麼重要？
JC: 我想這是我成長的一部份。我的父親也是一個鞋履設計師，這是我成長的過程。從小便培養我每天應該穿着整齊好看，看起來很可信的一種觀念。這與貧或富是沒有關係的，而是應該要好好裝扮自己，不一定要Chanel、Giorgio Armani，可以是本地一些設計。No fashion no people. 一個合適的風格便可以讓自己更加高貴和優雅。時尚對我而言沒有年齡限制，時裝設計師總是能夠帶些好東西出來的。時裝總是讓人感覺年輕，永遠不會老。
IH: 時裝很重要是因為他可以讓人的形象更加獨立，而且可以讓人開心的。因為如果你覺得自己每天都穿着漂亮，那肯定你每天都會很開心。
JC: 我想我很多的朋友選擇時尚都因為他們想看起來更好更年輕。當出去交際時，時常總能帶給別人開心，這是個好東西又不是什麼毒品哈哈！時尚也可以帶來金錢，你看看倫敦的時裝周為他們國家帶來了多少經濟活動。這就是為什麼有那麼多學校提供這方面的教育和支持給年輕人。
SP: 最後一個問題，Jimmy你可以給我們講五位你最喜歡和他們去派對的人嗎？
JC: Vivienne Tam…. 我喜歡跟能夠和願意回饋社會的人在一起，例如去一些慈善的派對。我們來這裡之前為MERCY一個慈善團體工作。他們會是幫助有需要的年輕人和老年人的。所以我喜歡的派對朋友肯定不只五個。那些人雖然很忙，但仍然會在這裏為人籌集資金，有心地去幫助人，這點我十分尊重。
SP: Mr. Jimmy很會跳舞嗎？
IH: 對的！
< < ENGLISH CONTINUED BELOW >>
SPITGAN : Hi Mr. Jimmy Choo how are you, and can you tell us where we are today?
Jimmy Choo : Well, I travel to different parts of the world, I do a lot of education; guidance for young people. I talk to them, share my experiences with them. I’m also the British Council alumni global ambassador, and the late Princess Diana, the (her) charity fund ambassador as well. Also, I am the Malaysian tourism ambassador! So I have been travelling to promote all these charities, and my country at once. In the meantime I do education, travelling to different parts of world, talking about my experiences. I also work with Illiza Ho on her handbag business.
SP : That’s a mouthful! Can you tell us how important hard work is to building a company like the international one you have built?
JC : I think in the old days everyone said hard working, but hard working is like nothing nowadays. Now there must be a network. In the old days, it was hard working because you could make a lot of things, and all that. Nowadays everything is on the internet you know. Facebook, Instagram these kind of things. So you have to know, know how to use this to promote your design as well I think . You must connect with people, that is what is important. I think business now is not just working hard, you have to be smart. For example, when I start my business, I didn’t have a reputation, nobody came to buy my shoes. They didn’t come to buy the shoes even for 50 pounds a pair! They don’t want it. Now my shoes are minimum 5000 USD, but they buy so many! Designers must know how to take care themselves. They have to work, but not necessarily harder. Long hours sometimes, as a designer you have to spend more time to do your production and designs as well, but be smart. Know how to adapt to people. Never say give up because there is no business. You must be smart. When I started my business, nobody came! Then let me sell some cheap shoes. Cheap shoes can help finance me, to help people live, and help me do what I want to do. I just don’t put my name Jimmy Choo, I put ‘handmade shoes’, something like that but that made money! You have to think a lot and change your mind. I sold them to market but not with the Jimmy Choo name. That money kept me going…
SP : Interesting. I think a lot of people nowadays they think about their reputation. Will there be harm in doing that…
JC : No. That’s why people said that, “Oh, why you associate with him etc…” No. Look at myself. When I started I was a nobody there. I had to do something from the bottom. If I can help them, why not? You know plenty people know who I am, it isn’t money money, it is how I feel in my heart, satisfied, happy, myself. That’s it. If it’s still money money, then, you know, I would ask a big investor to it to give me. I would start a new label again. It’s not that anymore, I think it’s more important that I am happy with who I am. I am traveling different parts of world, I am here today, to share my experiences, I am happy. Normally we trust people. We say we will trust people for a hundred thousand years, so you come to talk with them. You understand?
SP : Shoes are your family business Jimmy, what do women want in a shoe?
JC : I think they want pretty, and comfortable.. The most important thing they like is a pretty shoe. It looks pretty for them, then comfortable as well I think. But nowadays because we do high-end, we does many for the price. As long as they like the shoe they will pay for the price. More important is to look good, comfort, then last long.
SP : Have you even design men’s?
JC : I design men’s as well. I design for Aaron Kwok, his concert last year. I design for some royal families, men’s as well. I also design my own shoes haha!
SP : Sneakers?
JC : Sneakers… not at the moment haha!!!
SP : What are some of the accomplishments you are most proud of?
JC : I think I feel very happy and honored because in the education system in Malaysia, 9 year olds in school, students read my story in history lessons. I think that is more important than money. Once I am in the history, all the young people can look at what I’m doing for my country. I feel very proud. Also, I run to different parts of world, and everyone gives me good support.
SP : What is style to you?
Illiza Ho : I think everybody is an individual. So you need to know what is suitable for yourself. To look at fashion magazines, then pick up something for yourself. It’s not only to follow the trends. Sometimes the trend is not suitable for you. So I think the most important is to be yourself, and be comfortable.
JC : I think elegance is important.
SP : Yes! Tell us about your personal style. Cause you are always a well dress man!
JC : That’s because I am very lucky. In my home, Malaysia, I always have designer friends. When I travel or have public speaking (engagements), or when I have awards; a very famous tailor designer, he makes all the garments for me. Haha. (Shows me a card, Lord’s)
SP : Lord’s.
JC : Yes you can google them! They (have) made suits for the royal family, and film stars. Because Robert… he is maybe sixty years old now? When he young, 17 or 18 years old he learned how to design, and tailor cut everything. So everytime I wear their suits it will be suitable for me. I am also the ambassador for them as well. So everytime you see… every month I have got so many outfits haha.
SP : Every time we see photo of you, you are looking good!
SP : Do you think it is important Jimmy that as a creator, running your own company, there a point we need to relinquish some control?
JC : Definitely no doubt. You can’t do everything yourself. Just like me, I can’t do so many things. You have to share your job. When you are small, yes you can control everything. But when it goes big, you need to have different departments, different people. Keep reliable people to help you otherwise there will be problems. So you have to think about where you can get capable people. Then you have to give the people the right salary. You know there is no cheap labor. People also has to live as well. You have to keep them fed, then people will work for you as well. We can’t do everything ourselves, you must share. And you have to trust them. If you don’t trust them problems will arise. If you think they can’t do anything, or you are selfish, or scared people will copy your things … it won’t work. You must be careful and just see who is a capable person; who you can trust working with you. But you always should look for somebody better than you. Then you can learn things from them. I am not a good lawyer or accountant. You must share, you cannot do everything yourelf. You must have a good direction. You must let people fully understand what you want. Then they can perform for you.
So you have to be very clear yourself, if you are not clear then people will do it wrong. You know if you lose your temper, you lost everything. A very hard thing to do is keep calm. I also lose my temper sometimes. Sometimes I will shout, very strange shouting. Then they will know I am angry. But that is not good as well. Every time I scream, they say, “My father never treated me that way!”
SP : For the creative process it is important to be relaxed, and in a good space too..
JC : Yes, but nowadays you see they don’t. You see all the designers everything they do themselves. When you first starting new, they haven’t got enough money to hire so many people to help them. So they have to do everything themselves. Just like what I mean, in the old days I start at 7am, every 3 or 4 o’clock I go home. Then by 8AM, wake up and go again. So, in busy times like London fashion week, I remember once, maybe four days I didn’t go home. I slept in the workshop. Because if i go home, my staff wouldn’t work. There were too many designers coming. Too many designers coming and asking me to design their shoes, Helmet Lang, Paul Smith, for catwalk shows. As a leader, if I don’t work, they don’t work as well. You have to show them you are OK. Of course you have to take care them. Pay them on time, prepare food for them. Maybe they sleep 4 hours you sleep 2 hours, then we have to work again.
SP : They don’t let us sleep here hahaha!! We should use your message! Jimmy Choo said we need sleep (here, DIP Incubator) haha.
JC : I remember one day my staff fell down from the rack and all heels fell. Then he slept right then and there. LOL
SP : Where did you feel you are as a designer now, Illiza? Are you in a good space? Are you feeling creative, productive, and inspired because you working with some great people?
IH : I think I got the creative part because I work with Jimmy. I get the opportunities to fly to different countries and get lots of inspiration for the different cultures. That is quite important for me as a designer. (I believe) As a designer you need to see lots of things and get a lot of inspiration. That’s how I can create really different designs.
SP : Can you tell us about Mr. Jimmy Choo’s leadship style?
IH : Ha-ha. I feel Jimmy is quite a nice person. He is not selfish, so he can pass on any skills that he can. He doesn’t limit my design, my style. So that is really important for me because I don’t want to have people limit me or control my style too much. I feel a lot of freedom in design. I can do everything I want in design. It is quite important for the designer.
SP : Any future plans? Maybe both of you? Anything coming up?
IH: I think I will just keep going on my new brand and if can I will do lots of talks to next generation.
JC : Myself I will continue doing what I am doing. I like to travel different parts of the world, share my experience. Nowadays it’s very easy, they can track you by the internet; know what you do as well. I still do my couture under my Chinese name. You know I am a Chinese, a Malaysian Chinese. But still my father and mother are both Chinese. They have their own culture. I am proud of my Chinese name. I sold the trademark, but I still love to design. All the people know who I am and still want me to design shoes for them! I treat it as my hobby you know. I know a lot of film stars, royal families, close friends…
SP : Is it custom now? Only one piece?
JC : Yes it is, just like Bai Xuexian, I design shoes for her. She is about 90 years old now haha. Yeah i still designing shoes for her.
SP : You think you’ll ever stop?
JC : I don’t want to stop, I never feel old myself. I always thinking I am only 50 years old something. Even Giorgio Armani is 80-something and still working. He doesn’t have to work. He’s got so much money, a yacht, everything, but he still works. I think fashion always keep people young. You never feel old. Like Aaron Kwok says, age is only the number. If you see him dancing, he’s still like a young boy. But (it’s) how you feel inside your heart. I want to keep going, I never want to think about how old I am or how rich or poor I am. I am what I am. As long as I am not greedy, I do not harm people. I am good for my country, I also good for my school. Whatever they’ve done for me, they’ve helped me, I’ll give back to them. If I go different a country, I respect their laws and culture. That’s very important you know.
SP : Why is fashion important?
JC : I think that is how my father grew up. He is a fashion shoe designer, to me, that’s how I got my living. How i grew up is all from fashion. People have to look good, tidy, and look more responsible for themselves. It is not about how rich or how poor, they still must dress. Maybe not Giorgio Armani or Chanel everything; there are local people that can design for them. No fashion, no people. More elegance, more responsibility to look good for themselves. Fashion has no age to me, no age. Fashion designers can always come with something good for people. Fashion always look young. People never feel old.
IH : Fashion is important because fashion makes everybody an individual, and it keeps everybody smiling. Because if you dress up very nice, everyday will be a happy day for me and for everybody!
JC : I think a lot of my friends, they choose fashion (because) they want to look good and young. You know, going to social. Fashion has a happiness for everyone. It’s good. It’s not alcohol, or a drug for people I think. Fashion also brings money. You see UK fashion week bring so much economy for the country. That is why so many colleges show up to teach young people.
SP : Last question. Jimmy, can you list us top five friends you like to party with.
JC : Vivienne (Tam?). I like to party with people who can give back to society, like parties for a charity event . Before we came over here, we working with MERCY. It is a charity to help those people, young people, and old people who need it. That the party people I love to mix with. It’s more meaningful for me.
SP : Is Mr. Jimmy Choo a very good dancer?
IH : Yes, he dances well.
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